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Everything Between Heaven and Earth and Beyond

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    Henric C. Jensen
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On Israel and Lebanon

July 27, 2006 7:32 AM

“against Israel’s war on Lebanon.”

The problem is that this isn’t Israel’s war on LEBANON – this is Israel’s response to acts of war perpetrated against Israel by HEZBOLLAH.

As I have posted elsewhere in this discussion – HEZBOLLAH deliberately use the Lebanese civilian population as human shields, by placing their military posts, munitions caches and missile launch pads within civilian vilages and apartment blocks.

To disregard this FACT is to judge Israel and Hezbollah very unfairly and biased.

July 27, 2006 7:46 AM

It is not Israel’s war on LEBANON, as I said above, it’s Israel’s response to acts of war perpetrated against it by Hezbollah.

Israel has repeatedly warned the civilian population in southern Lebanon and urged them to get out of the way – as Hezbollah uses civilian quarters for their military posts etc.

Israel is NOT targeting the civilian Lebanese population – Israel is targeting Hezbollah military targets and personnel. Any nation at war would do the same.

Hezbollah is deliberately targeting civilian targets.

July 26, 2006 4:05 PM

“Given the indigenous nature of Hezbolla’s resistance, we should not be surprised at the lengths the Shiite militia is going to ensure their loved ones, and the Lebanese people more generally, are not put directly in danger by their combat.”

This is interesting, since the favorite trick used by Hezbollah, Hamas and earlier PLO is to set up military positions and hiding military material, such as explosives, in the midst of villages and apartment blocks – thus using the civilian population as human shields, knowing full well that there will be an out-cry against Israel as soon as one civilian is killed.

But I suppose this little tidbit of information has eluded the good Jonathan Cook

What makes me so angry is that the World in general is so willing to deny any culpability on part of those terror organizations, their grunts and their financiers as well as supporters world wide.

Haim Harari spoke about this: Undeclared WWWIII – a good piece of writing that, while not being absolutely objective, at least unveils the powers behind the grunt-level terrorists.

July 26, 2006 3:11 PM

Those mentioned news papers and media channels are also wellknown for their biased reporting on events in the Middle East, especially when it comes to reporting about Israel/Palestine – one such example is the news story by the New York Times that started the reporting from the latest intifada in 2000, another is this interesting news clip from Channel 4.

Both show how these so called respected news sources deliberately distort and skew what they see or are sent to report. And yes, they always skew and distort to the disadvantage of Israel.

I am not asking them to be Pro-Israel at all costs – I am asking them, and you and the rest of us to be HONEST, FAIR and OBJECTIVE.

The sources you cited above are neither HONEST, nor FAIR or OBJECTIVE.

We cannot expect the parties to the conflict to be objective – but we can demnand that those who are not directly involved actually take their obligations as journalists seriously and report the world event, truthfully and objectively.

uly 25, 2006 4:33 PM

perhaps Lebanon should stop harboring and aiding terrorists? You see, Israel wouldn’t attack southern Lebanon if Hezbollah wasn’t being allowed by Lebanon to set up camp and attack Israel from there.

The thing is that ANY other Sovreign State in the world would be allowed to defend themselves by targeting the enemy’s military positions – exactly what Israel is doing – but because it’s Israel it’s not ok…

Is it Israel’s fault that Hezbollag uses the civilian Lebanese population as human shields, and deliberately place their Katyusha launch pads in the center of villages? – they actually ACTIVELY (read by force) hindering the civilian population from leaving the areas in Souther Lebanon that is being tageted by Israel (in response to the Hezbollah bombardments.)

There would not have been 300 civilan casulties on the Lebanese side of the border, if Hezbollah didn’t break the laws of war in this way.

July 25, 2006 5:09 PM

“Especially when I hear and see Israel tanks and plains shooting onkids..but I guess I’d have the same reaction towards any violence, waretc… Also, like Zahara said there have been more Lebanese deaths than Israeli..Oh my ! Now I’m comparing numbers of deaths!!”

But have you actually asked yourself WHY the Israelis at times shoot at children?  Or ambulances? Because the Terrorists deliberately use KIDS and AMBULANCES as HUMAN SHIELDS. Have you asked WHY the number of dead on the Lebanese are so many compared to on the Israeli side? Because the Israelis not only allow their citizens to leave the area for safety – they are actively encouraging people to go to safe areas – and let’s not forget that on the Israeli side there are Israeli Arabs being killed – by what – missiles fired by Hezbollah.

July 25, 2006 6:16 PM

I think you are missing my point here – “A Murderer is a Murderer by ANY name, ANY nationality, and by ANY religion.” I have never justified indiscriminate killing bay anyone – but fair has to be fair – if you call Israel murderers, you have to call Hezbollah, Hamas, and other Palestinian terrorist organizations murderers too.

Where is your “Attackers create the Defenders” now? -Israel wasn’t the one attacking Lebanon – Hezbollah was the one attacking Israel, willingly aided by Lebanon and others.

July 25, 2006 7:00 PM

“but against a state as militarily powerful as the US or Israel non-traditional forms of resistance are likely the only one’s that haveany hope of success.”

If those non-traditional forms of warfare are so successful, one cannot but wonder why the Palestinians are still using them, and why Israel is still there – wouldn’t the success of non-traditional war-fare have erradicated Israel long ago…??

My primary reason for posting this Blog for discussion here was to provide some objective information on the current situation, from a source that takes analysing the media coverage of Israel vs the rest of the Middle East from a point of wanting fanatically to find the truth and clean up in the myths around what is happening –

Someone that will report the facts without all the emotional and fundamentalist garbage.

In my mind HonestReporting manages to be Pro-Israel without being Anti-Palestinian/Arab and without swallowing what is propaganda from both sides. Something I have worked hard at doing in this Group whenever the topic of Israel/Palestine has come up. So has Ket. Neither side is served by propaganda and emotional excess, in fact propaganda and emotional excess only serve to obscure the facts.

This is the main reason religion does not belong in th discussion, IMO.

To answer your questions – I ‘ll give you one-liners I think is pertinent for a true and peaceful solution.

1. Israel needs to stop settling out-side the borders of 1948.

This includes removing the wall where it intrudes on Palestinian territory – if Israel wishes to let its border be marked by a Wall around all of Israel, for protection – that is its prerogative, it is also its prerogative to have check-points with whatever kind of control mechanisms it thinks necessary along said border – like any other country.

2. The Arabs, including the Palestinians, need to accept Israel within the borders of 1948.

This includes stopping any violent actions against Israel as a Nation or Israeli civilians and military.

3. The International Community needs to take control of areas of religious contention

– that includes the entirety of Jerusalem and any other religious sites that are of significance to the Abrahamic Faiths. Those areas should NEVER be controlled by any of the parties to the conflict, Jewish, Muslim or Xian.

4. The Palestinians need to stop whining about pieces of land that were lost fair and square in the 1948 war.

This means concentrating on doing what the Jews have been doing for 100 years in the area – building a fertile country that can and will sustain their population.

5. The Arab Nations, rich with oil and loaded with money, need to stop spending their money on weapons to terrorist organizations.

This means starting to actively aid the Palestinians build a fertile Homeland within the Palestinian borders of 1948.

6. Mrs Arafat’s bankaccounts need to be seized by International Law-Enforcement. That money need to be distributed to the Palestinians, as the money was originally meant for them.

Harsh? Yes. But it is a fact that The Arabs lost the war in 1948 – just like Finland lost Karelia and Petsamo in 1944.

Israel was military on an equal footing with the Arabs at that time, or let’s say they were, not to embarras the Arabs. The Arabs had every chance to expell the Jewish People – they failed. The division of the area in two parts, one Jewish and one Palestinian is a fact. The Arabs need to accept that. That is the only way there is ever going to be peace.

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